hornarama
2500+ posts
04/04/12 02:53 PM
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Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
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Why do we emphasize the fade so much? If you don't have a big tall athletic receiver with great hands, along with a QB that is consistently accurate, the fade sucks. Recognizing the limits of my (imperfect) memory watching from the stands, I really don't remember too many successful fades (in any meaningful situations) in the last several years. Yet watching the spring highlights, there were a number of fade routes (as usual) thrown. I've grown to hate our fade attempts, because it seems against any decent competition we hit about 1 in a 100.
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texas_ex2000
1000+ posts
04/04/12 03:15 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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I have no opinion on the post.
But it does jog my memory of two great fade routes.
Major to Brian White - Nebraska (more of a fly route the more I look at it)
Vince to Limas Sweed - Ohio St.
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PropositionJoe
500+ posts
04/04/12 03:20 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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i dont think you HAVE to have a tall WR to run the fade.
the routes just have to be run correctly and the QB has to deliver the ball to the right spot.
more reps=hopefully better at running the play when it counts.
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Hpslugga
10,000+ posts
04/04/12 03:42 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
i dont think you HAVE to have a tall WR to run the fade.
Exactly. You just need a guy who has a decent vertical and is reliable at fighting for the ball when it's thrown.
The Bridge Builder
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Longtex
100+ posts
04/04/12 03:55 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: Hpslugga] |
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In reply to:
fighting for the ball
[censored] me, but this has made me crazy the last couple of years! I don't give a [censored] if you get flagged for offensive PI, go get that (*&@#$&% ball! The penalty's better than the INT, and that is OUR ball, not the defense's ball. Kick that sumbitch in the nuts, knee him in the stomach, do what it takes - lay out and eat turf when you hit, but that's OUR ball.
/rant
"Don't talk to me about woulda-shoulda-coulda... what shoulda happened DID happen." -- Saint Darrell Royal, c. 1961
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dheiman
500+ posts
04/04/12 04:07 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
this has made me crazy the last couple of years
You and me both brother. We haven't had a dominating receiver in some time. One on one our receivers haven't been the dominant force in the past 5-6 seasons. Injuries and youth might be part of that problem as well but I would kill to have another Wane McGarity or Roy.
Life's certainties: Death, Taxes and OU sucks.
Get your gear at choke-lahoma.com
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1leggedduck
1000+ posts
04/04/12 04:23 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
that is OUR ball, not the defense's ball
That's funny. That's what I used to tell my middle son (the mean one) during basketball games. "Hey boy, they got your ball. You gonna let them play with your ball?"
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Third Coast
10,000+ posts
04/04/12 04:41 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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I'm very particular about who I let play with my balls.
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RomaVicta
10,000+ posts
04/04/12 04:52 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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Ash and Shipley connected on a beautiful fade at the Spring Game. I think what made it work was Shipley's explosive burst to the corner after the ball was thrown leaving the db confused about where to be.
But I'm no expert.
Brewer threw a beautiful arching td pass himself Sunday. He hit another perfect pass on the sideline dropping the ball where only the receiver had a shot at it. Of course, it was 3s vs 3s, so I'm not advocating a QB controversy or anything.
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georgecostanza
500+ posts
04/04/12 04:54 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
I'm very particular about who I let play with my balls.
The real question is, are you master of your domain?
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Uninformed
10,000+ posts
04/04/12 05:14 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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FIFY
<Jerry Sandusky> I'm very particular about who I let play with my balls. <Jerry Sandusky>
Hookem
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Texas Taps
5000+ posts
04/04/12 06:53 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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I'm going to bleed orange until the day I die
-Vince Young
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BigEarlinBastrop
500+ posts
04/04/12 07:25 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
that is OUR ball, not the defense's ball
Totally agree about needing this attitude. And Shipley has it. Remember him fighting for ball as he came down on goal line? (atm? Holiday Bowl?) Anyway, he literally took back an intercepted ball.
"... and it's good-bye to a&m." 
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TNLonghorn
500+ posts
04/04/12 09:49 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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Shipley 2.0 is a force to be reckoned with. He is not afraid of being a badass football player.
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PhantomHorn
5000+ posts
04/05/12 05:07 AM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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Best fade pass I ever saw was Garder to Kerry Cash in 1st qtr of 1990 Texas/OU game. video. forward to 23 minutes
If you let Rome teach
your children; don't be surprised when they grow up to be
Romans.
Edited by PhantomHorn (04/05/12 05:17 AM)
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PropositionJoe
500+ posts
04/05/12 07:40 AM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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i always feel weird talking football "theory" on a thread that hp is on. i feel like i'm going to get something wrong and he's going to give me the "i award you no points and may god have mercy on your soul" speech.
that being said, how the WR starts the play is just as important as how the WR ends the play with a fade--getting off the LOS and using hands to get the DB on their heels is important. i've seen guys who lack the power at the LOS do a quick stutter to get one step on the DB in an effort to get to the corner.
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Detective Shilala
2500+ posts
04/05/12 08:02 AM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
[censored] me, but this has made me crazy the last couple of years! I don't give a [censored] if you get flagged for offensive PI, go get that (*&@#$&% ball!
I was very disappointed to see Mike Davis allow a go ahead interception on Sunday. So its not catchable, so two DBs have a better shot at it than you. But at least try and get in the goddam way...
I thought the guy had gotten his head right, but his body language was like "aw hell, I don't even give a [censored], have the pick". Looked a lot like the Mike Davis of last year.
Edited by Detective Shilala (04/05/12 08:04 AM)
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hornpharmd
10,000+ posts
04/05/12 08:05 AM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: Hpslugga] |
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In reply to:
You just need a guy who has a decent vertical and is reliable at fighting for the ball when it's thrown.
And better throws. Both in terms off ball placement and in terms of not throwing when the DB is not playing tight at the line. If the DB is playing off and basically in the endzone waiting for that pass then that is a mistake.
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Hpslugga
10,000+ posts
04/05/12 08:16 AM
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In reply to:
i feel like i'm going to get something wrong and he's going to give me the "i award you no points and may god have mercy on your soul" speech.
Well you might be an aggie, but you haven't veered into AggieEric-esque aggydom, at least not yet 
In all seriousness, you're right about what's needed out of a WR in a fade concept. And, IMHO, it's a much broader concept than just football. Would anyone, for example, go to the Basketball board and ask why any team utilizes the alley oop when they don't have a 7-footer on the team? That question is never asked. You also won't see anyone on the Baseball board asking why a team doesn't put its tallest two players at right and left field.
In football, it's a general rule of thumb that your X and Z (outside receivers) are taller than the inside receivers, but that's exactly what that is: a rule of thumb. It's just assumed that those 3-4 people have similar-ish vertical jumps, and if that's the case, you definitely want the tallest guy out there. But sometimes it's not true, and you can end up with cases that lead to things like Jaxon Shipley being the best option for a fade route even though he's only 6'1". Why is he the best option? He consistently has the best technique, runs the best routes, and gives the best effort when the ball is in the air. I'd rather that than a 6'6" guy that can't do those things as well as a 6'1" that can.
The Bridge Builder
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Statalyzer
25,000+ posts
04/05/12 04:59 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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This thread brings back the 2009 OU game when we kept trying to throw fades to Jordan Shipley for some reason and they never worked.
We're Texas
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GabeRocksSocks
1000+ posts
04/05/12 07:32 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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In reply to:
Vince to Limas Sweed - Ohio St.
Immediately came to mind. One of the most memorable fades in history for me.
"'Enourmous [sic] upside' is just another way to say we suck." - Texags wisdom
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majorwhiteapples
5000+ posts
04/06/12 01:01 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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I watched that Fade to Shipley for the first time, and only one time, I think you have to give him some, not sure of the word......
He had quick hands, meaning he didn't put his hands up to the last second....... I would bet his eyes were not following the ball either. I only saw the play once, but I looked at the defender and it sure looked to me like he could have made a play on the ball if he knew it was coming.
When Ship caught it, the defender looked disgusted with himself as it didn't seem the ball was out of his reach.
I am just guessing and I only watched the play once but I just couldn't believe that the defender couldn't make a play on that ball, not sure who it was, I don't think it was Bynum(sp).
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hornarama
2500+ posts
04/06/12 02:38 PM
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Re: Emphasis on fade routes without right personnel
[re: hornarama] |
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Seriously, when I've watched us throw fades it seems to be extremely rare the ball is anywhere near catchable. I should've probably emphasized the ATHLETIC and GREAT HANDS over the tall, but if you don't have some size it is pretty damn hard to "body up" and hold your ground to make a play on the ball. And a "good" fade in the spring game against 2nd string or walk on defensive back is not quite the same as "decent competition." We're going to win against the 2nd tier competition for the most part. The time I want plays like fades to work is against the teams that we really need it to work. Clearly, (Colt) McCoy was an extremely accurate QB and I had no problem with him throwing anything he wanted to--although I did get tired of the GD horizontal game. But for our QB's the last couple of years it seemed an improbable event to connect on a fade given that most of the time the ball was thrown 5 yards out of the end zone. I would've much preferred taking chances with a zipped ball down low to someone.
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